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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 12:28 
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Lieutenant
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Joined: Tue 8 Nov 2011 22:40
Posts: 1261
Yupi wrote:
It sounds like a bug or a really stupid decision by game devs.

And it's very easy to fix with the obvious fix.

Veterancy bonuses shouldn't be absolute ffs but relative. So vet 1 gives you 20%(or whatever is deemed right) increase to the basic values, vet 2- 40% and so on.

Then when you have 5% for a unit without stabilizer + 20% of that 5%= 6%. With vet 4 it will be 9%.

On the other hand if the unit has stabilizer and his basic accuracy is 15%. With vet 1 it will be 18%. And with vet 4= 27%.

So the veterancy will still be handy for any unit but the balance between vetted cheap and elite units will be the same as with unvetted ones.

Really can't see any reason why it wasn't done in the first place.

This is probably the simplest way of solving the problem of unequal power of veterancy, make it a percenatage and all units will benefit equally to veterancy. The accuarcy bonus should be 25% per level to be on par with the cost increase, maybe 30-35% for it to be an attractive choice (if few high quality units kan kill exactly the same amount of things as many low quality units, it's better to get the low quality units because they're harder to kill).

It would be necessary to revisit the accuarcy/cost of a few units that really require vet to be functional though(chapparall, I'm looking at you).

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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 13:34 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Wed 18 Jan 2012 10:03
Posts: 220
Location: hungary
An other nice rush. Seriusly its exactly the same what bentguru and JMWW2 did on this map.

select units + move fast and GG.
http://www.wargamereplays.org/index.php?page=replay&id=238


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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 14:50 
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Sergeant First-Class

Joined: Sun 12 Feb 2012 20:27
Posts: 113
marder "rush" isnt really about the unit to some degree in this replay, at the end of the day he split his forces into three (2 defensive areas and a small attack force) AND spent 220 more on a command vehicle and 100 on a fob, thats worth a lot of units, whereas i spent my money on units and concentrated my forces besides a small amount i spent on an effective defence, thats where this game was won and lost

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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 15:38 
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Staff Sergeant

Joined: Sun 12 Feb 2012 18:22
Posts: 98
These Marder VTSI rushes are annoying. could not stop them with decent T-62 tanks, ATGM jeeps and infantry...

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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 17:41 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Wed 18 Jan 2012 10:03
Posts: 220
Location: hungary
well if i have a little more luck, my helos snipe your CV. The funny thing is i thought you are a pro player who bought an other CV or has a lot of AA. All i had to to is spam some cheap heli and snipe your CV.


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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 18:03 
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First Sergeant

Joined: Sat 18 Feb 2012 23:10
Posts: 212
Yupi wrote:
It sounds like a bug or a really stupid decision by game devs.

And it's very easy to fix with the obvious fix.

Veterancy bonuses shouldn't be absolute ffs but relative. So vet 1 gives you 20%(or whatever is deemed right) increase to the basic values, vet 2- 40% and so on.

Then when you have 5% for a unit without stabilizer + 20% of that 5%= 6%. With vet 4 it will be 9%.

On the other hand if the unit has stabilizer and his basic accuracy is 15%. With vet 1 it will be 18%. And with vet 4= 27%.

So the veterancy will still be handy for any unit but the balance between vetted cheap and elite units will be the same as with unvetted ones.

Really can't see any reason why it wasn't done in the first place.


By far the best idea in this thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 18:55 
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Sergeant
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Joined: Sun 26 Feb 2012 07:33
Posts: 77
shamalol wrote:
Yupi wrote:
It sounds like a bug or a really stupid decision by game devs.

And it's very easy to fix with the obvious fix.

Veterancy bonuses shouldn't be absolute ffs but relative. So vet 1 gives you 20%(or whatever is deemed right) increase to the basic values, vet 2- 40% and so on.

Then when you have 5% for a unit without stabilizer + 20% of that 5%= 6%. With vet 4 it will be 9%.

On the other hand if the unit has stabilizer and his basic accuracy is 15%. With vet 1 it will be 18%. And with vet 4= 27%.

So the veterancy will still be handy for any unit but the balance between vetted cheap and elite units will be the same as with unvetted ones.

Really can't see any reason why it wasn't done in the first place.


By far the best idea in this thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 19:03 
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Chief Warrant Officer

Joined: Wed 22 Feb 2012 15:14
Posts: 649
Veterancy cannot be nerfed to omuch or you will simply degenerate even more but into rushes of 2-3 types of cheap vehicles.

What need to be done is reduce a bit the cost of high end units , add some tight turns in the rods, so that rushign trough fast move units get cramped.

And give pact some units that is cheap enoguh but can coutner those. My suggestion.. increase accuracy of t72 (including the cheap german 40 cost one) by 1.


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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 19:07 
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Second-Lieutenant

Joined: Sat 25 Feb 2012 06:18
Posts: 783
Location: Québec
tiago wrote:
Veterancy cannot be nerfed to omuch or you will simply degenerate even more but into rushes of 2-3 types of cheap vehicles.


I don't understand your point, the way veterancy works is why people are rushing with just 2 or 3 types of weak vehicules. It makes a mass of very weak tanks stat wise in an unstoppable blob of death (I'm being hyperbolic here, but it's because I love that). Right, the heavy MBT are too expensive for what they do, but veterancy is clearly the main problem here.


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 Post subject: Re: Marder VTSI rush
PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 20:19 
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Chief Warrant Officer

Joined: Thu 30 Jun 2011 15:12
Posts: 616
tiago wrote:
Veterancy cannot be nerfed to omuch or you will simply degenerate even more but into rushes of 2-3 types of cheap vehicles.

What need to be done is reduce a bit the cost of high end units , add some tight turns in the rods, so that rushign trough fast move units get cramped.


Reducing the cost of high end units will make the pricing system would have many bad consequences. I think a better solution is to increase income from sectors, so that the high end units can be afforded alot quicker. It wouldn't do much to stop VST1 spam, but it would change the dynamic of the game I think. I also think that the fact that all units have the same main gun range is a bad decision, which is unrealistic and makes expensive units bad value.


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