What people dont seem to understand is that these arty spammers or unit spammers, dont actually care if they win or lose. They spam arty and then waste it all in like one big fireworks display once they have ran out of ammo or their spammed units failed they quit and find another game thats just starting to repeat the process. I had this just now someone spammed nothing but GRADs and FOB's soon as it started he said "watch this" then just fired all his rockets onto the enemy base didnt actually do much kgot about kept doing it for about 5mins then earned himself about 500 points then was like "bye bye bitches" and left.

Exactly. And sadly, the game even in ranked play often rewards this mindset.

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You see a similar bad attitude on the forum, usually by people defending things like rockets (though they always say that they only 'sometimes' use them). Coincidence I'm sure.

The thing is that they won't even care if they get nerfed - they'll just leave the game and go play something else.

You dont know what you are talking about. They are fine. The problem is economic not unit stats. If they were nerfed as you say then they would be useless in 1v 2v and 3v.

Never let lowest common denominator and casuals decide unit balance.

I assure you I'm in for the foreseeable future. My guess is the next time we see anything like this is around 2028.

First of all, Eugen needs to fix the artillery bugs. Until that's done balancing is useless. More info here:

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=3469

Next, most people really do play terribly. You can't balance the game to please people who don't know how to play.

Next, they need to make the pricing internally consistent. There are some units that are so much better than others that it makes all other choices obsolete. This may or may not change when bugs gets fixed: we'd need to reassess the thing then.

Next, if and when we get new victory modes Eugen needs to decide whether they want to balance for one certain game type or some sort of their own vision of what the game should be. If units were free and you'd play command post hunt, would artillery still be overpowered? More info about upcoming changes here:

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3470

And after that, if artillery is still too dominant then Eugen needs to start working on whatever the balance issue is. I have a hunch most of the arty hate springs from three things:

1) bugs (pinpoint accuracy, unintuitive impact patterns, ROF bug, possibly morale)
2) wrong mental model of how the game plays
3) relative expense of the units people want to use, and the effectiveness of artillery against these particular targets (top-end tanks, large-ish groups of tanks). You only get a few of these expensive toys on the field and they're easily wrecked by especially artillery as it now stands.

I'm very interested in hearing your analysis what the game would and should be like after the bugs are fixed and average level of play is reasonable.

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Wargame: Disco Edition

http://i.imgur.com/KwSCdxW.png

I agree with you - the lowest common denominator are the ones defending rockets because it gives them an edge with little skill involved. The vast majority of players, including the best players, all agree that artillery and its effects require a nerf/fix.




Actually not massively different! Tube artillery only needs a slight tweak - a small number of units are a little too accurate when unvetted and uncorrected. Again rockets only need a small tweak. There needs to be a cap on their numbers per game, and they should not have such a large effect on armoured units. They also need their reload time to be increased by quite a large amount.

These are hardly earth shattering changes, and we would still see them used in games, but no longer abused.

Seriously it'll break the game for 1v1 and 2v2 if artillery is nerfed. Actually think about it instead of just asperging out all over the forum. It isnt a problem at all with any kind of sane starting resources. It's only a problem in 3v and 4v scrubfests.

I don't use rockets at all as I have said. The only arty I use is danas and paladins and even then its rare because of the resource requirements/effectiveness ratio.

There is the issue where certain shots will hit target regardless of spotting - that is a technical issue not a balance issue. nerfing because of a technical issue will not solve that problem at all because it will still remain.

It's not rocket science, am I just being trolled here? It boggles the mind.

A hardcap would not solve your problem of not being able to beat it either - in fact it would make it harder because an arty heavy force is easy to beat.

Ah, so you don't know what you're talking about. The correct units to use are Auf1, MSTA (or maybe Malka), Smerch, Buratino and MRLS. Why not try those and see what the problem is? Buratinos are used alone, everything else in pairs. Tubes are used at pinpoint targets you can see, rockets every time you see a HQ, cluster of lightly armored units or supply vehicles. Buratino works against anything, the more the better.

Same goes for anyone else claiming arty is fine: try those units and see if you agree afterwards. All the other arty units are crap in comparison. AML 60 is bugged, but while you're testing...

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Wargame: Disco Edition

http://i.imgur.com/KwSCdxW.png

I've had people use literally walls of them against me. It's hard to understand at first but as I said, going arty heavy means you are weak everywhere else.

It reminds me of RUSE where person A would get raped by arty, go complain on forum, Person B gets raped by arty, goes to look on forum to read up on a counter and instead just sees people whining about it. Person B then thinks the units are OP and joins in and it snowballs from there.

For the massive price tag i'd expect them to be decent units.

Did you try them yourself? In pairs? At the situations I described? Because I sure as heck don't remember saying the problem is a million guns firing all over the countryside. The problems are in my previous post laid out as clearly as I possibly can. Try those and reassess the situation.

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Wargame: Disco Edition

http://i.imgur.com/KwSCdxW.png